bretm
Aug 17, 12:07 AM
Was there any doubt it wouldn't be a lot faster? I mean, I know it was already plenty fast, but come on...
But it's not faster. Slower actually than the G5 at some apps. What's everyone looking at anyway? I'm pretty unimpressed. Other than Adobe's usage of cache (AE is a cache lover and will use all of it, hence the faster performance).
But the actual xeon processors are only as fast as the G5 processors. Look at the average specs... the 2.66 machines are only a teeny bit faster than the G5s except in a few apps like filemaker. But not in the biggies like Final Cut Pro where it actually appears that mhz for mhz the G5 is a faster machine hands down!
But it's not faster. Slower actually than the G5 at some apps. What's everyone looking at anyway? I'm pretty unimpressed. Other than Adobe's usage of cache (AE is a cache lover and will use all of it, hence the faster performance).
But the actual xeon processors are only as fast as the G5 processors. Look at the average specs... the 2.66 machines are only a teeny bit faster than the G5s except in a few apps like filemaker. But not in the biggies like Final Cut Pro where it actually appears that mhz for mhz the G5 is a faster machine hands down!
aafuss1
Jul 14, 11:54 PM
Interesting question, but I don't think any of us here will have the answers.
PCs don't use EFI. I don't know if a generic AGP/PCIe card can be initialized by EFI, or if the card will need some EFI code to be on-board.
As for OS X, I think we can be fairly certain that Apple will only bundle drivers for cards that Apple sells. If you install a third-party card, they will probably tell you that you'll need a driver from the card's manufacturer - that's what they've historically told customers.
Generic VGA drivers? I'm sure they were developed - they'd be very useful during that time when OS X/Intel was internal-only. But I wouldn't expect them to be bundled with a shipping copy of the system software.
Now, assuming that the Mac firmware (including whatever EFI drivers they include in it) is capable of initializing a generic video card, then there should be no need for more than a device driver, which the card vendors can probably provide, if they are so inclined. If the cards will require special ROM code for EFI, however, then we're back to the same problem that plagued the PPC systems.
I agree-eg. to add a Crossfire configuration would mean that Apple would need to have a preference pane to configure that, which they don't-they supply a driver only.
PCs don't use EFI. I don't know if a generic AGP/PCIe card can be initialized by EFI, or if the card will need some EFI code to be on-board.
As for OS X, I think we can be fairly certain that Apple will only bundle drivers for cards that Apple sells. If you install a third-party card, they will probably tell you that you'll need a driver from the card's manufacturer - that's what they've historically told customers.
Generic VGA drivers? I'm sure they were developed - they'd be very useful during that time when OS X/Intel was internal-only. But I wouldn't expect them to be bundled with a shipping copy of the system software.
Now, assuming that the Mac firmware (including whatever EFI drivers they include in it) is capable of initializing a generic video card, then there should be no need for more than a device driver, which the card vendors can probably provide, if they are so inclined. If the cards will require special ROM code for EFI, however, then we're back to the same problem that plagued the PPC systems.
I agree-eg. to add a Crossfire configuration would mean that Apple would need to have a preference pane to configure that, which they don't-they supply a driver only.
twoodcc
Aug 11, 10:10 AM
bring it on!! my razr isn't that impressive. in fact, not any phone i've ever had was. maybe apple can change this
wmmk
Aug 17, 09:49 AM
I don't like Adobe anymore. :mad:
I dunno, I mean, I guess they could use core image, but really. CS3 will probably have PS, Illustrator, ID, FW, Flash, DW, CF, Contribute, Bridge and Acrobat. That's 10 apps. Would you want to develop 20 apps, just so that Mac users could have Core Image? Until competitors come along with Core Image support, don't expect Adobe to have it.
I dunno, I mean, I guess they could use core image, but really. CS3 will probably have PS, Illustrator, ID, FW, Flash, DW, CF, Contribute, Bridge and Acrobat. That's 10 apps. Would you want to develop 20 apps, just so that Mac users could have Core Image? Until competitors come along with Core Image support, don't expect Adobe to have it.
zooniverse
Aug 8, 06:48 AM
love the new features so far. Hopefully a UI refresh will be one of the top secret features to finally get rid of the dated brushed-metal finder etc...
Multimedia
Aug 26, 07:50 PM
I Just Hope Apple Joins The Rest Of The Manufacturers In This Mass Announcement. I'm afraid they won't due to EGO problems. :rolleyes: In this case, I wish they wouldn't "Think Differently".
vincenz
Apr 28, 01:30 PM
Trump is the ultimate troll. Worst of all, he's just getting tons of free publicity every time the subject is brought up.
edgcrshr
Apr 8, 12:22 AM
I am still waiting on my black 16gb wifi, I preordered it Sunday after launch and am still waiting for Best Buy to call me. I guess I am going to have to call them and see what is going on. I have not been looking elsewhere since I wanted to get it from them and use gift cards, looks like that may not be happening anymore.
twoodcc
Aug 11, 09:35 PM
My point is, earlier you were saying that they only have 4 games and they sold 57M copies. If you look at that link, which is right from Polyphony themselves, you will see that if you only count the 4 main games, as you were eluding to, that only totals 46M.
let's see, my original post:
yes it has been out for awhile, but they still haven't released the 5th game yet (not including demos). so either way, there's only 4 versions of the game out. at over 57 million copies sold, i'd say they sold a fair few...
noticed i said, "not including demos". which all other versions are, except for the psp game. granted, the last demo, or prologue, is a PS3 greatest hits.
So, you don't count NFS? Ok then. If I'm understanding you correctly, you are really only comparing GT to 1 other console game; Forza. It is the only other console game of any similar type. But, using your own logic, is it fair to compare GT to Forza, since GT has been out much longer and has many more games in the series? I mean, if we don't get to compare GT to NFS because of that, then surely you shouldn't compare GT to Forza for the same reason.
well let's compare it to NFS then, shall we? NFS debuted in 1994, and has their 16th release scheduled for release about the same time as GT5. so almost double the amount of games, if you include the prologues, or demos. and on top of that, NFS isn't just PS3. and it's available on a pc as well.
is it still a fair comparison? even though they are different games, they are both racing games. but if we go off number of sales (since you seem to think b/c i mentioned it, it's the only thing i take into consideration) NFS: 15 games, available on some 10 platforms, if not more. and over 100 millon.
GT5: 8 titles, 3 of which are prologues (demos). debuted in 1997. only playstation. over 57 million.
i'd say GT5 stacks up very well with NFS, considering everything. again, just looking at sales here
I really like you're choice of quoting.
hey, nothing wrong with wikipedia. they have links there for reference. i mean, all anyone else is gonna do is google stuff. how is that better?
...of which about 1/3 of them are various Civics, Skylines and Imprezas.
that's still not the point. having that many cars adds to the game, and adds up in data on that one disk. i'm sure many players drive those same cars in real life
...ok, that one is good. That says something.
yes it does. GT5 is only on playstation. it has been on every version now, including the psp.
...that no one ever drove, because it couldn't even get up the hilly parts of some tracks. Total waste.
again, that's your opinion. there might be some that liked those things. i personally didn't see much use either though
...really? Oldest car and Largest guide?? REALLY?? Yikes.
with so many cars, and so many races, some need a guide. some races are very difficult.
Um, according to your OWN link, the car was cancelled. And really, that isn't surprising. It is a concept car, plain and simple. So again I ask, what REAL cars have ever ACTUALLY been made just to be in this game??
nice catch. i'd say that's a pretty recent cancellation. but i did see a video of one somewhere, so i believe they made one somewhere.
but again, it still is a real car. and the intention of producing 6 of these cars was for this game. that is clear.
let's see, my original post:
yes it has been out for awhile, but they still haven't released the 5th game yet (not including demos). so either way, there's only 4 versions of the game out. at over 57 million copies sold, i'd say they sold a fair few...
noticed i said, "not including demos". which all other versions are, except for the psp game. granted, the last demo, or prologue, is a PS3 greatest hits.
So, you don't count NFS? Ok then. If I'm understanding you correctly, you are really only comparing GT to 1 other console game; Forza. It is the only other console game of any similar type. But, using your own logic, is it fair to compare GT to Forza, since GT has been out much longer and has many more games in the series? I mean, if we don't get to compare GT to NFS because of that, then surely you shouldn't compare GT to Forza for the same reason.
well let's compare it to NFS then, shall we? NFS debuted in 1994, and has their 16th release scheduled for release about the same time as GT5. so almost double the amount of games, if you include the prologues, or demos. and on top of that, NFS isn't just PS3. and it's available on a pc as well.
is it still a fair comparison? even though they are different games, they are both racing games. but if we go off number of sales (since you seem to think b/c i mentioned it, it's the only thing i take into consideration) NFS: 15 games, available on some 10 platforms, if not more. and over 100 millon.
GT5: 8 titles, 3 of which are prologues (demos). debuted in 1997. only playstation. over 57 million.
i'd say GT5 stacks up very well with NFS, considering everything. again, just looking at sales here
I really like you're choice of quoting.
hey, nothing wrong with wikipedia. they have links there for reference. i mean, all anyone else is gonna do is google stuff. how is that better?
...of which about 1/3 of them are various Civics, Skylines and Imprezas.
that's still not the point. having that many cars adds to the game, and adds up in data on that one disk. i'm sure many players drive those same cars in real life
...ok, that one is good. That says something.
yes it does. GT5 is only on playstation. it has been on every version now, including the psp.
...that no one ever drove, because it couldn't even get up the hilly parts of some tracks. Total waste.
again, that's your opinion. there might be some that liked those things. i personally didn't see much use either though
...really? Oldest car and Largest guide?? REALLY?? Yikes.
with so many cars, and so many races, some need a guide. some races are very difficult.
Um, according to your OWN link, the car was cancelled. And really, that isn't surprising. It is a concept car, plain and simple. So again I ask, what REAL cars have ever ACTUALLY been made just to be in this game??
nice catch. i'd say that's a pretty recent cancellation. but i did see a video of one somewhere, so i believe they made one somewhere.
but again, it still is a real car. and the intention of producing 6 of these cars was for this game. that is clear.
mdelvecchio
Mar 22, 01:00 PM
Look at the specs, their greater or equal to the iPad 2 with the exception of battery life.
...you overlook that specs dont make the product -- quality and usefulness do.
...you overlook that specs dont make the product -- quality and usefulness do.
rovex
Mar 22, 02:51 PM
Keep telling yourself that. You'll sleep better at night.
Since it's true (I'm certain) you can enjoy living in a dump.
People like you don't get far in life, sorry to say.
If you can't spell "they're" correctly "you're" hardly a credible source.
Battery life is worse because of the specs. Considering that the iPad can play sufficiently high-bitrate videos, I don't see much value in reducing battery life to compete on the basis of specs.
Wrong. Battery life is worse because the size is considerably smaller.
Since it's true (I'm certain) you can enjoy living in a dump.
People like you don't get far in life, sorry to say.
If you can't spell "they're" correctly "you're" hardly a credible source.
Battery life is worse because of the specs. Considering that the iPad can play sufficiently high-bitrate videos, I don't see much value in reducing battery life to compete on the basis of specs.
Wrong. Battery life is worse because the size is considerably smaller.
milo
Jul 27, 01:03 PM
this would be smart because as of right now the mac book pro doesnt WOW me over the macbook. Do you think the "core 3" will also have the same pin structure as the 2's?
The next gen of chips has 4 core versions of conroe and woodcrest, each with the same sockets as the ones they're replacing. Not sure if there will be a 4 core merom.
How about a new Mac at WWDC?
Lower Model:
CConroe E6300 - 1.86 GHz � FSB1066 � 2 MB cache - ($185)
1GB RAM
160GB Serial ATA hard drive
Double-layer SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD�RW/CD-RW)
One open PCI-Express expansion slot
One open Optical drive slot [maybe] (i.e. for 2nd DVD drive)
Graphics Card with 128MB SDRAM
Built-in AirPort Extreme and Bluetooth 2.0, USB/FW800
Remote [(?] I think this box will still be small enough to fit into home entertainment setups.]
Keyboard, Mighty Mouse...................................................... $999
Some Options:
Conroe E6600 - 2.40 GHz � FSB1066 � 4 MB cache � (+$100)
Wireless Keyboard/Mouse +$60
Add DVD/CD ROM drive (in 2nd slot) + $50
250GB SATA hard drive +$75
+1GB RAM (2GB total) +$100
+3GB RAM (4GB total) +$300
Slightly Better Graphics Card with 256MB SDRAM + $50
Much Better Graphics Card +$200+
http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/9648/macandmacminipx9.jpg
Pretty cool, but it needs a real name, MAC won't cut it. Maybe Mac Express?
And it wouldn't have FW800 or a second optical slot. Probably a second HD slot instead. And I'd guess it would be more of a pizza box enclosure, but that's wild speculation. Your price is probably way too low, too.
The next gen of chips has 4 core versions of conroe and woodcrest, each with the same sockets as the ones they're replacing. Not sure if there will be a 4 core merom.
How about a new Mac at WWDC?
Lower Model:
CConroe E6300 - 1.86 GHz � FSB1066 � 2 MB cache - ($185)
1GB RAM
160GB Serial ATA hard drive
Double-layer SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD�RW/CD-RW)
One open PCI-Express expansion slot
One open Optical drive slot [maybe] (i.e. for 2nd DVD drive)
Graphics Card with 128MB SDRAM
Built-in AirPort Extreme and Bluetooth 2.0, USB/FW800
Remote [(?] I think this box will still be small enough to fit into home entertainment setups.]
Keyboard, Mighty Mouse...................................................... $999
Some Options:
Conroe E6600 - 2.40 GHz � FSB1066 � 4 MB cache � (+$100)
Wireless Keyboard/Mouse +$60
Add DVD/CD ROM drive (in 2nd slot) + $50
250GB SATA hard drive +$75
+1GB RAM (2GB total) +$100
+3GB RAM (4GB total) +$300
Slightly Better Graphics Card with 256MB SDRAM + $50
Much Better Graphics Card +$200+
http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/9648/macandmacminipx9.jpg
Pretty cool, but it needs a real name, MAC won't cut it. Maybe Mac Express?
And it wouldn't have FW800 or a second optical slot. Probably a second HD slot instead. And I'd guess it would be more of a pizza box enclosure, but that's wild speculation. Your price is probably way too low, too.
eelpout
Apr 11, 04:31 PM
And you'll be complaining about battery life and the Android experience in a few days.
Spoken like someone who hasn't used a recent Android device. On my Gingerbread phone I lost like what, 10-12% overnight in 8 hours? Battery life isn't an issue anymore. Though it is acceptable to dislike Android for other reasons. ;)
Spoken like someone who hasn't used a recent Android device. On my Gingerbread phone I lost like what, 10-12% overnight in 8 hours? Battery life isn't an issue anymore. Though it is acceptable to dislike Android for other reasons. ;)
xStep
Apr 6, 06:22 AM
I'm willing to bet there will be a price drop and only available on the Mac App Store.
I doubt it will be available on the Mac App store. Think about how much space FCS requires.
I doubt it will be available on the Mac App store. Think about how much space FCS requires.
raymondso
Sep 19, 09:18 AM
0710 PDT - no updates yet - keep counting :-(
1:40 to go :p
1:40 to go :p
T-Reese
Aug 5, 03:38 PM
cant wait... merom book pros cmon!!!!
ergle2
Sep 13, 01:18 PM
The OS takes advantage of the extra 4 cores already therefore its ahead of the technology curve, correct? Gee, no innovation here...please move along folks. :rolleyes:
As for using a Dell, sure they could've used that. Would Windows use the extra 4 cores? Highly doubtful. Microsoft has sketchy 64 bit support let alone dual core support; I'm not saying "impossible" but I haven't read jack squat about any version of Windows working well with quad cores. You think those fools (the same idiots who came up with Genuine Advantage) actually optimized their OS to run in an 8 core setup? Please pass along what you're smoking. :rolleyes:
The Datacenter editions of Windows Server 2003 can handle up to 64 cores.
As for using a Dell, sure they could've used that. Would Windows use the extra 4 cores? Highly doubtful. Microsoft has sketchy 64 bit support let alone dual core support; I'm not saying "impossible" but I haven't read jack squat about any version of Windows working well with quad cores. You think those fools (the same idiots who came up with Genuine Advantage) actually optimized their OS to run in an 8 core setup? Please pass along what you're smoking. :rolleyes:
The Datacenter editions of Windows Server 2003 can handle up to 64 cores.
ezekielrage_99
Jul 27, 10:04 PM
This was one of the advantages of the G5 but IBM stalled and Intel has essentially blown past everybody. AMD will answer no doubt, but it appears that Intel has about a 6 month jump on them.
AMD has it's hands full with an ATi take over which gives Intel the chance to get a bit a head on the Processor game. Either way it's good Intel has some real competition it means faster cheaper chips.:cool:
AMD has it's hands full with an ATi take over which gives Intel the chance to get a bit a head on the Processor game. Either way it's good Intel has some real competition it means faster cheaper chips.:cool:
FF_productions
Aug 15, 01:04 PM
My main interest is in FCP the FCP results.
On a fixed budget, does anyone know the advantage/disadvantage of going for the 2.0Ghz with 1900XT over 2.6Ghz with the std video card?
Video cards won't make a difference in FCP as of now if that's what you are asking performance wise. If you are using Motion/Games, anything that really feeds off the video card, then I'd go for the higher end video card.
Otherwise I'd go for the 2.6 ghz.
On a fixed budget, does anyone know the advantage/disadvantage of going for the 2.0Ghz with 1900XT over 2.6Ghz with the std video card?
Video cards won't make a difference in FCP as of now if that's what you are asking performance wise. If you are using Motion/Games, anything that really feeds off the video card, then I'd go for the higher end video card.
Otherwise I'd go for the 2.6 ghz.
j_maddison
Jul 20, 11:53 AM
How fast do you want mail to go?
As fast as possible! Don't worry I do agree that e mail and browsing has very little to do with the processor speed, still you did ask the question! Now if only I could get a fibre link to my house without it costing a few hundred thousand Pounds a year hmm :rolleyes:
As fast as possible! Don't worry I do agree that e mail and browsing has very little to do with the processor speed, still you did ask the question! Now if only I could get a fibre link to my house without it costing a few hundred thousand Pounds a year hmm :rolleyes:
BLUELION
Apr 7, 11:29 PM
The price is set by market conditions to some degree and on the other the producer of the product can set the price despite those conditions.
If you think it is overpriced, then don't buy it. Its that simple. If you owned the Apple, you would price things how you saw fit and influenced by the market conditions. Keep in mind the point of the game is to make money.
Apple products are price-locked. No second hand retailer marks up on them, like Bose. Retailers are told what to sell at and they comply or they lose rights to sell the product. If these are overpriced, it is Apples doing.
If you think it is overpriced, then don't buy it. Its that simple. If you owned the Apple, you would price things how you saw fit and influenced by the market conditions. Keep in mind the point of the game is to make money.
Apple products are price-locked. No second hand retailer marks up on them, like Bose. Retailers are told what to sell at and they comply or they lose rights to sell the product. If these are overpriced, it is Apples doing.
thevofl
Aug 7, 05:32 PM
1) When I did a system restore at work, it restored everything back on the date. I lost all my work since the date.
2) Something tells me that the Super Duper top secret stuff has more to do with multimedia integration: a skype-type feature for calling a phone number using iChat, expansion of bonjour, a multimedia hub similar to tivo.
3) For those at the conference, what was under the black sheet covered banners?
2) Something tells me that the Super Duper top secret stuff has more to do with multimedia integration: a skype-type feature for calling a phone number using iChat, expansion of bonjour, a multimedia hub similar to tivo.
3) For those at the conference, what was under the black sheet covered banners?
NoSmokingBandit
Aug 19, 07:28 AM
I'm 100% sure the GT site says all the cars were remodeled for the ps3, as in not the ps2 cars.
The massive lineup of cars from past Gran Turismo games has been beautifully recreated through the latest technology and the Playstation 3’s cutting-edge graphics.
http://us.gran-turismo.com/us/news/d5247.html
recreated
As in not copypasta'd over from gt4.
The massive lineup of cars from past Gran Turismo games has been beautifully recreated through the latest technology and the Playstation 3’s cutting-edge graphics.
http://us.gran-turismo.com/us/news/d5247.html
recreated
As in not copypasta'd over from gt4.
ergle2
Sep 14, 10:49 PM
Really, completely new? As in, to Core 2 what the G5 was to G4? In just two years?? I guess they're really ramping things up... Core 3 Hexa Mac Pros, anyone?
Intel's stated plans as I understand them are thus:
A new micro-arch every 2 years. I don't think they mean brand new so much as "significant changes/improvements". Whether this is akin to Yonah->Conroe or Netburst->Conroe remains to be seen, but more like the former (or perhaps Pentium-M -> Merom -- Core Duo was very much a stop-gap). Little has been released about Nehalem, but at one time it was slated as "based on Banias/Dothan", due in 2005 and expected to ramp to 9/10GHz.
"Off" years will recieve derivative versions (e.g. Merom->Penryn), which appears to be mostly stuff like L2 cache increases, faster FSB speeds (at least while we have FSBs - 2008 looks like the year for DCI, finally), die shrinks, increasing the number of cores (expect at least one to be more cores on a single die instead of two dice/package), etc.
Die shrinks are currently scheduled for "off" years, in order to stablize the process ready for the new micro-arch in the following year so Intel doesn't need to deal with both new process and new arch at the same time, and presumably in part to keep speed increases coming in "off" years
Of course, roadmaps can change quite rapidly -- it's not that long ago that Whitfield was expected to debut late 2006 with DCI (FSB replacement). Whitfield was replaced by Tigerton which is now due sometime in 2007...
One thing's for sure, Intel appears to have learnt a great deal from the Netburst fiasco -- how not to do things, if nothing else. Unfortunately, they still estimate ~50% of processors shipping in 1Q2007 will be netburst-based (mostly Pentium-D).
Intel's stated plans as I understand them are thus:
A new micro-arch every 2 years. I don't think they mean brand new so much as "significant changes/improvements". Whether this is akin to Yonah->Conroe or Netburst->Conroe remains to be seen, but more like the former (or perhaps Pentium-M -> Merom -- Core Duo was very much a stop-gap). Little has been released about Nehalem, but at one time it was slated as "based on Banias/Dothan", due in 2005 and expected to ramp to 9/10GHz.
"Off" years will recieve derivative versions (e.g. Merom->Penryn), which appears to be mostly stuff like L2 cache increases, faster FSB speeds (at least while we have FSBs - 2008 looks like the year for DCI, finally), die shrinks, increasing the number of cores (expect at least one to be more cores on a single die instead of two dice/package), etc.
Die shrinks are currently scheduled for "off" years, in order to stablize the process ready for the new micro-arch in the following year so Intel doesn't need to deal with both new process and new arch at the same time, and presumably in part to keep speed increases coming in "off" years
Of course, roadmaps can change quite rapidly -- it's not that long ago that Whitfield was expected to debut late 2006 with DCI (FSB replacement). Whitfield was replaced by Tigerton which is now due sometime in 2007...
One thing's for sure, Intel appears to have learnt a great deal from the Netburst fiasco -- how not to do things, if nothing else. Unfortunately, they still estimate ~50% of processors shipping in 1Q2007 will be netburst-based (mostly Pentium-D).
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